Reel Gear Physics

Reels are the hottest topic for TackleTour. Everyone wants to know what the latest and greatest is and how they compare to the old guard. What's the best for light stuff, or what's your suggestion for heavy cover. Do we really need different retrieve ratios? It's all in here.
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LgMouthGambler
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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by LgMouthGambler » Sun Feb 26, 2017 7:30 pm

Tavery5 wrote:
IAY wrote:
Tavery5 wrote:
IAY wrote:
Tavery5 wrote:

The longer wrench does not add torque, it reduces the amount of force required to achieve the same amount of torque through leverage.
There is no leverage in reels and there is no leverage in wrench. Leverage requires an object to exist past the fulcrum, you are just applying power to the drive gear which is a fixed point. Torque calculation is (radius)x(Force)x(angular factor based on the direction that force is being applied and direction the lever is turning). If you increase the length of the handle, you are increasing the torque.
Or reducing the amount of input force required to obtain the same torque. Please explain what object is past the fulcrum in a class 2 or class 3 lever.
There is no object, we are literally turning the handle to turn the drive shaft.
I will concede to your argument if you put a name to the mechanical advantage that is gained by adding length to a device used for applying torque.
It's called leverage
<")))><{

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by IAY » Sun Feb 26, 2017 11:05 pm

People want to talk, when they don't understand physics :lol: :lol:

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Tavery5 » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:56 am

IAY wrote:People want to talk, when they don't understand physics :lol: :lol:
So help a brother out, what is it's name?

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Slazmo » Tue Feb 28, 2017 6:33 am

I actually thought this thread was going to be about gear teeth and the machining of and how slight variations of cut / pitch etc will help gear train physics?

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by IAY » Tue Feb 28, 2017 8:11 am

Tavery5 wrote:
IAY wrote:People want to talk, when they don't understand physics :lol: :lol:
So help a brother out, what is it's name?
I was not referring to you with my previous comment. I just find the people who are hellbent on calling this leverage over torque to be hilarious. Leverage is the effect of output force being greater than input force, and torque is the force to rotate an object. We are rotating the drive gear when we are turning the handle, and people apparently don't believe that :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Tavery5 » Tue Feb 28, 2017 9:39 am

IAY wrote:
Tavery5 wrote:
IAY wrote:People want to talk, when they don't understand physics :lol: :lol:
So help a brother out, what is it's name?
I was not referring to you with my previous comment. I just find the people who are hellbent on calling this leverage over torque to be hilarious. Leverage is the effect of output force being greater than input force, and torque is the force to rotate an object. We are rotating the drive gear when we are turning the handle, and people apparently don't believe that :lol: :lol: :lol:
In a nutshell it sounded like to me what was being said was, "You can increase the amount of torque applied to the input shaft with a longer handle by making use of the mechanical advantage known as leverage."

Maybe I misunderstood.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Mike and Pike » Tue Feb 28, 2017 2:49 pm

Slazmo wrote:I actually thought this thread was going to be about gear teeth and the machining of and how slight variations of cut / pitch etc will help gear train physics?
I didn't. But that would have been cool.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Mike and Pike » Tue Feb 28, 2017 3:22 pm

Wahhooo semantics!

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by mark poulson » Tue Feb 28, 2017 11:44 pm

Tavery 5 said, "In a nutshell it sounded like to me what was being said was, "You can increase the amount of torque applied to the input shaft with a longer handle by making use of the mechanical advantage known as leverage."

I agree.
Maybe the topic should be, "How leverage is applied during the retrieve with a baitcasting reel through the use of a longer handle".
Anyone who has used a longer handle knows it is easier to crank under load.
If that's not applied leverage, it should be! :lol: :lol: :lol

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Tony9 » Wed Mar 01, 2017 12:12 am

My original question was just wondering if two identical reels would crank the same given different gear ratios and handle length.

If you were deep cranking, would a reel with a 5.0 gear ratio and 80mm handle crank with as much power as a 6.3 (rounded up from 6.25) gear ratio and 100mm handle?

Or would they feel the same given you lose 25% going from a 5.0 to a 6.3 but you gain it back by going from a 80mm to 100mm handle?

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by mark poulson » Wed Mar 01, 2017 12:36 am

Tony9 wrote:My original question was just wondering if two identical reels would crank the same given different gear ratios and handle length.

If you were deep cranking, would a reel with a 5.0 gear ratio and 80mm handle crank with as much power as a 6.3 (rounded up from 6.25) gear ratio and 100mm handle?

Or would they feel the same given you lose 25% going from a 5.0 to a 6.3 but you gain it back by going from a 80mm to 100mm handle?
I'm pretty sure there are mathematical formulas that can compare the two different gear/handle combinations.
That's way beyond my pay grade.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by LowRange » Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:59 am

Tony9 wrote:My original question was just wondering if two identical reels would crank the same given different gear ratios and handle length.

If you were deep cranking, would a reel with a 5.0 gear ratio and 80mm handle crank with as much power as a 6.3 (rounded up from 6.25) gear ratio and 100mm handle?

Or would they feel the same given you lose 25% going from a 5.0 to a 6.3 but you gain it back by going from a 80mm to 100mm handle?
Define power. In what ways do you perceive a reel as powerful? If you define more powerful as needing less effort then yes a longer handle will need less effort to turn than a short handle. A 10 mil differenece is too small to percive IMO.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by Mike and Pike » Wed Mar 01, 2017 6:08 am

LowRange wrote:
Tony9 wrote:My original question was just wondering if two identical reels would crank the same given different gear ratios and handle length.

If you were deep cranking, would a reel with a 5.0 gear ratio and 80mm handle crank with as much power as a 6.3 (rounded up from 6.25) gear ratio and 100mm handle?

Or would they feel the same given you lose 25% going from a 5.0 to a 6.3 but you gain it back by going from a 80mm to 100mm handle?
Define power. In what ways do you perceive a reel as powerful? If you define more powerful as needing less effort then yes a longer handle will need less effort to turn than a short handle. A 10 mil differenece is too small to percive IMO.
The ability to pull big blades/baits. That is how I would define a powerful reel.
And when you are pulling big blades and bills all day it is percievable/obvious that a cm or two longer handle does absolutely help.
And semantics aside , the abilty to pull bigger baits is all I am concerned about so gear and handles swaps are the answer.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by mark poulson » Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:57 am

I find that having two bearings in the handle knobs make all the difference when I'm throwing a moving bait all day. Handle length is secondary for that, although I prefer 90 mm+-, because it feels right to me.

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Re: Reel Gear Physics

Post by BARRAMANIAC » Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:59 am

I work in heavy industry/ mining equipment and here is an example I have to offer.
If you have a series of nuts and bolts that have to be set a specific torque and you have a choice of torque wrenches with a 2foot handle or a 4 foot handle the 2 foot handle is going to take more effort/force to achieve the same result. the longer handle does allow you to apply more torque if the same amount of force/effort is used.

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