Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

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DavidFishingCA
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Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by DavidFishingCA » Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:32 pm

Hi All,

I was looking for some advice on a long 8-9 ft rod for trout fishing. I currently have the Tenryu Lunakia 610 which I absolutely adore for its sensitivity and the feel it transmits when fighting fish (many thanks to TroutMagnetMan for his excellent videos and recommendations on this rod). However, I am finding that my casting distance for smaller marabou jigs and minijigs in the 1 gram range is short of where I'd like it to be and that my heavier minnow plugs and spoons are over the recommended lure weight cap (7g vs 5g max cap) which makes me fear damaging the rod.

I was doing some research and found a few candidates, but I'd like some advice from the folks here before I make a final decision.

Possible candidates:
Yamaga Blanks Blue Current 83 TZ/Nano
Tict Ice Cube IC-86.5TB-Sis Rockin' Beast

I'm definitely open to any other suggestions/brands

Budget around $400, Max $500
Fish sizes: mainly 1-2lb trout, occasional fish to 5 lbs with 10 lbers possible

Thanks in advance for any information!

Allsorts
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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Allsorts » Wed Mar 18, 2020 11:59 pm

Off the top of my head, the longer Aji / Mebaru style rods are the only options within the weight parameters given. Also have a look at Evergreen Salty Sensations, I'm sure you've looked at Graphiteleader options already. Just be aware that 1-2g heads won't cast that much further, the longer Aji rods are usually designed for Caro style which is basically mid-water Carolina rigging. I've got a 7'6" Evergreen SS Superior which is amazing in that it can genuinely cast 1-18g. However, I've found that only once I get to 3g heads does it feel really good. Do have a look at Tict Caros and European bombardas / siburlino techniques as a way of presenting small offerings at distance. You can reach out 50 yards and present something 1" long if you need to. Finally, you will need to use a high quality braid to get the best out of these rods. PE 0.4 to maximum 0.6. Varivas Super Trout Advance PE or Sunline Light Game PE are lines I can recommend. These rods are exclusively designed for braid so guides are selected with braid in mind, they will be small to tiny. Based on my own experience, I wouldn't go above 8', these rods are surprisingly stiff and fast, sort of L tip and M butt. The marginal increase in casting distance will come at the cost of a heavier, stiffer rod.

DavidFishingCA
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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by DavidFishingCA » Fri Mar 20, 2020 7:40 pm

Thanks for the detailed information you've provided, the caro/bombarda techniques look very interesting! I would be using the Varivas Infinity PE (the 0.2 PE version) with the rod. I really like the castability and strength of this line. The only thing I struggle with a bit is that it appears to have a tendancy to ride up into water column making it difficult to work my spoons as deep as I'd like. For diving crankbaits/jerkbaits and jigs maintaining the depth seems to be less of an issue.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Allsorts » Sat Mar 21, 2020 7:16 am

Keeping lures at depth at long range is a problem I have had to solve as well. Have a look at heavier stock spoons like Art of Fishing's Northern Bite https://fishingmania.club/en/northern-b ... te-68-g-24. These are designed to stay down a bit better, basically just thicker bodies.

Other options:
The jigging spoon style - as I understand it the Japanese are using a new technique for trout in lakes which is like the new SW slow jigging technique. The spoons/jigs wobble on the fall, so they twitch them up and then let them drop (basically like fishing a grub). These spoons are lead or zinc and designed to fall slowly and more or less horizontally. They are incredibly effective in the salt, literally catching everything, no doubt trout will eat them too. Search Zetz Slow Blatt, look at the 'Z' Metal models https://www.krakenzone.com/lures/zetz-s ... -oval.html.

Another option is to use small metal vibes, JDM models are made down to 3g. They cast a long way and also catch everything. Ecogear ZX is one version that I like as its much less snaggy than the normal metal vibes. https://www.ecogear.jp/eng/ecogear/hardbaits/zx.html They can be jigged, burned or slow rolled. I've got lots of bass on these, especially when they are shut down. Alphahawk has had good panfish and smallie success with the Magbite version https://www.digitaka.com/list.php?categ ... N+MCFLY+6g

Personally, if I need to fish far, low and slow, I use Smith Niakis 6g spinners - Chris at Finesse Fishing is now carrying the 6g also https://www.finesse-fishing.com/smith-niakis.html.

Final option is the Smith Troutin Surger http://www.startackle.com/smith-troutin ... html?st=en. These swim like a spoon and wobble on the drop. Cast like bullets and stay down if not retrieved too fast. This style of lure is very popular in the Baltic for sea trout (brownies that run to sea) and they use a 'spin-stop' retrieve. Basically they wind in and then stop briefly, the lure drops and wobbles like a wounded fish and following trout often commit at that point. Definitely worth trying with this style of lure. There are many sea trout spoons available from the EU, but they are usually 3/8-1oz which is a little big probably.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by DavidFishingCA » Thu Mar 26, 2020 5:05 pm

Thanks for the additional information, this is very helpful. I have a few Troutin Surgers and the side to side roll it does on the fall is very pronounced, way better than the Lucky Craft Wanders.

After a bit more research the Salty Sensations series looks very promising. I'm especially interested in the SPRS-70L-T. It ticks most of my boxes save length. From a video I found of it being used on giant herring it looks like it could handle large trout and work larger plugs.

I am also considering the PSSS-77S Limit Breaker. However, it has a solid tip which I have read gives less tactile feedback compared to a tubular tip. I much prefer feeling the bite through the rod (the main reason I love the Lunakia so much) as well as the fight of the fish.

Also looking at the Tict IC-74PT-Sis as well. Not sure how the Ice Cube stacks up against the Salty Sensations.

Any input on these rods or further rod suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by EuanDenny » Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:15 am

Hello DavidFishingCA, please consider the Yamaga Blanks Blue Current 76/TZ, super light 69g, versatile rod can cast jig heads from 0.5g to 5g, plugs 1.8g-7g, and I've used it for drop shot 7g-10g. Very sensitive blank, Fuji Torzite guides, long casts are effortless.
Caught Rainbows to 2.5lb handled beautifully,I'm sure larger fish will be no problem.
This awesome rod puts a smile on your face, please check it out...

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Senkobass1 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:13 pm

The Yamaga Blanks BlueCurrent TZ is a very nice rod. Compared to the mini jig rods we fish in California, it is a much stiffer rod. Can feel the jig on the line, but can’t really get the best action for the jig. For trout jigging in California, I prefer a moderate tapered rod to keep the jig in the strike zone longer. It’s sacrifices a bit of sensitivity, but they hold onto the jig very well and keeps those fish pinned.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Trout Bloke » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:02 pm

Senkobass1 wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:13 pm
The Yamaga Blanks BlueCurrent TZ is a very nice rod. Compared to the mini jig rods we fish in California, it is a much stiffer rod. Can feel the jig on the line, but can’t really get the best action for the jig. For trout jigging in California, I prefer a moderate tapered rod to keep the jig in the strike zone longer. It’s sacrifices a bit of sensitivity, but they hold onto the jig very well and keeps those fish pinned.
I bought a new YB Blue Current 71 TZ/Nano recently and have been able to get out and fish it once for river trout using 1/32 and 1/16oz mini jigs (both custom tied and mini tubes). Casts like a dream using 3lb Varivas Hi vis nylon mono. As for jig action it does very well despite being stiff and trout take the jig 95% of the time on the fall anyways. If the bite is hot then you feel a good tug and more subtle bites can be detected by feel.

I bought this rod for both streams and slow water and I'm impressed so far. I can twitch jigs, or use my index finger or both for lively jig action. I live in Northern CA and wild river trout can be quite fiesty compared to the stockers found in lakes, these native trout grow up fighting river currents their whole lives so they are in great fighting shape.

An ajing rod in the 7-8ft has the about the right stiffness needed for wade fishing using light line and mini jigs in stream or rivers for trout. The longer length helps keep the jig in the strike zone longer and I've had big trout take the jig right up close without being spooked.
Last edited by Trout Bloke on Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ultralight
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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by ultralight » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:13 pm

I'm not sure if I read you right. You want max distance for 1 gram lures?

If so, there's diminishing returns where a rod can get too long and actually reduce casting distance. With very light lures, the percentage of drag from line on the guides and the whippy rod is high relative to the kinetic energy in a 1 gram lure. I would guess 9 feet will cast less than 8 feet.

I would guess that around 7 to 8 feet would be ideal - if properly built

I think a great 6 1/2 feet rod can cast as far as the 7 footer. I don't have much experience beyond 7 feet but know others who have 8 footers.

Just one person's thoughts.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Trout Bloke » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:13 pm

Well made video displaying how the well the BlueCurrent Jighead Special 71/TZ NANO loads when casting various weight lures:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xjtpxRxy74&t=

The 71/TZ Nano and its smaller models are designed to use both PE and Nylon/FC lines. The larger Blue Current models only list PE line so I suspect they are designed for that. Just something to keep in mind:

https://yamaga-blanks.com/product/light ... nt-tznano/

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Alphahawk » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:31 pm

ultralight wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:13 pm
I'm not sure if I read you right. You want max distance for 1 gram lures?

If so, there's diminishing returns where a rod can get too long and actually reduce casting distance. With very light lures, the percentage of drag from line on the guides and the whippy rod is high relative to the kinetic energy in a 1 gram lure. I would guess 9 feet will cast less than 8 feet.

I would guess that around 7 to 8 feet would be ideal - if properly built

I think a great 6 1/2 feet rod can cast as far as the 7 footer. I don't have much experience beyond 7 feet but know others who have 8 footers.

Just one person's thoughts.
I own a BC TZ 8' 3" Long Cast. You are 100 percent spot on about casting micro light jig heads. I lose distance casting with that rod. I have had it for a number of years and rarely use it.

Regards

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by ultralight » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:11 pm

By the way, you also need to match the rod to your capacity to cast the rod quickly.

Some guys have this incredibly fast twitch muscle and a can really SNAP the rod. In that case, you don't really need the lure to load the road - the rod blank, guides, wrap, and finish easily load the rod. In those cases, you can actually have a stiffer road and cast a great distance.

Others have a more leisurely cast even when they really try to cast for distance. In those cases, you do need a more limber rod that will load up more easily to help with the distance.

I have a friend who managed the fishing department of a major sporting good store. He has over 100 rods and helped designed some rods for Kencor and Fenwick. For him, the longest casting distance for 1 grams jigs is about 6 to 6.5 feet. I don't find that 7 feet long rod add that much distance. Maybe 2-3 feet max? I am now actually going shorter to about 5.5 and 6 feet long rods simply because they are lighter, easier to handle, and are more pleasurable to use with better control. But I do still have my longer rods. I am not trying sub 5 feet rods - those do shorten casting distance for sure, but can still be surprisingly excellent. And there's a kind of 'fun' factor with short rods.

In short....perhaps I'm saying that longer is not always longer casting or better.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Trout Bloke » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:07 pm

I started trout fishing again about 4 yrs ago using mini jigs. I bought (2) Daiwa Spinmatic rods in 6.5ft and 8ft length and a Shimano Sedona 1000 spooled with 4lb Pline CXX. The 8ft Spinmatic rod would always outcast the 6.5ft Spinamatic by at least 10ft further using 1/16oz jigs. I later used an 8ft Okuma Guide Select Pro Trout rod, which is much stiffer and found its casting distance the same as the 8ft Spinmatic. The stiffer Okuma did handle larger trout better than the more limber Spinmatic.

I have since moved up to JDM rods but most if not all of the JDM maker's descriptions list the longer rod lengths for casting longer distances with light jigs or lures.

Yamaga Blanks Blue Current 83/TZ NANO Flex's description, this rod is rated for jigheads 0.8~5g with PE line 0.2~0.6 and they recommend reel sizes: DAIWA #2000 / SHIMANO #2000~C2500:

"If you wish to deliver light weight of jig head farther than ever and manipulate it as you want, we are sure that 83TZNano will make you satisfied. Flexibility and sensitivity of blanks enable you to manipulate light weight of plug delicately even you have delivered it farther than you have expected, you can manipulate it as you are at close range. Blanks bend smoothly like seamless even fish run toward you closer than expected and repulsive force will be enhanced more and more. If it is rough condition at closer range of you, you can fight without anxious thanks to ability of reshaping itself speedy and forcefully after bend deeply."

Not saying anyone is wrong here (all good info) but based on my experience certain rods longer than 7ft do cast light jigs down to 1/16oz further than shorter rods (and I have several 5ft and 5'6ft UL and L rods too).

Keep in mind at least for the Blue Current series they suggest 2000-2500 size reel sizes using PE line for their rods longer than 7ft 1". So if you prefer 1000 size reels then choose a Blue Current rod from the JH-Special 71/TZ NANO or shorter.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by ultralight » Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:42 pm

Trout Bloke.

Excellent post. Love all the interactions here.

If I read you correctly, you mentioned 1/16th jigs twice. If so, I agree 100%. I am talking about 1/32 or lighter jig. I find that the lighter the jigs, more an overly long (that's subjective as to how long is overly long) rod negatively impact casting distance. That's why for heavier lures, distance casters use longer rods. For example, for surf fishermen casting lures that in the multiple ounce range, they use rods over 10 feet. I think with 1/32nd or lighter jig, the limited kinetic energy of that Ul jig will be killed by all the extra friction from the guides of a 10 feet rod.

I am now going down to 1/64th jig as being more productive in the waters I frequent. I do need to do some tests....

I have a cheap 6' UL rod that is relatively heavy and loads up on its own weight. That one casts surprisingly far no matter what UL lures I use because of it loads itself with a fast snap. What you give up is sensitivity given its weight. A bit sluggish. But it sure can cast and still catch trout.

ps: Also, I wonder how accurate the suggestions from JDM rodmakers are. I've gotten in rods that I disagree with on their ratings such as lure weight range or line pound test.

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Re: Advice on 8-9ft JDM rods

Post by Trout Bloke » Tue Apr 07, 2020 8:40 am

UL,

Good stuff indeed. I throw mostly 1/16oz and 1/32oz jigs during the winter on the river, conditions are low flows (about 250cfm) and semi clear. However I found throwing 1/32oz jigs required alot more effort, enough that I had to start considering lighter than 4lb line. In checking my notes after this past winter I found 1/32 oz jigs were more effective in certain shallower stretches of the river, they simply hang in the strike zone longer. So that's when I discovered Alphahawk's videos and JDM rods which also brought me here.

Based on your findings and others, one would be better off using under 7ft rods if wanting to maximize casting range of 1/32oz (approx 1 gram) and lighter jigs etc. However they might be better off choosing an upper 6ft to 7ft rod as the sweet spot if their casting included 1/32 and heavier 1/16oz (1.8 gram) jigs since rod guide resistance should begin to diminish significantly at that weight. Of course smaller line diameter is a huge factor. Each person will have to determine what line is best for their gear and quarry. In other words how low are you willing to go and willing to risk if the big ones lurk? Lols!

I have not tried 1/64oz jigs but I am intrigued to try them. Plus it's another reason to to buy another rod or dedicated reel for 2 or 2.5lb test.

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