Guide Reccomendation

When production rods are not enough, it's time to go custom. Come share your experiences building and/or ordering a custom rod and tell us if you'll ever go back to off the shelf.
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white84z
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Guide Reccomendation

Post by white84z » Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am

I've been wanting to build a rod for a while now so I figured I would get practice on an old rod that needs new guides. I've got a 7' MH TFO Professional rod that lost a couple of rings so I stripped all the guides and plan to do a simple spiral to start as I plan on spiral wrapping any rod I build. I plan on using Fuji's CC Fazelite K guides as they should in theory hold up better to the high salinity levels in the water down here. Rod will have a shimano SLX or TD Fuego CT on it spoiled with 30lb sufix braid. Not worried about passing a leader knot, if I use a leader it's usually short enough to cast without feeling the knot past the tip guide.

I've got a couple of questions regarding guide sizing and quantity.

1. What sizes would you recommend for the stripper, bumper and runner guides?
2. Do you size the tip the same as the runners or smaller?
3. How many of the heavier footed belly guides should I use after the stripper? Looks like Fuji suggest 2-3, wanted to see if it was even warranted.
4. I have read that I will need to start with the same amount of guides in the original config, flip the runners 180 and static test it to verify correct placement. How are you guys securing guides to static test them where they won't come off?I was thinking some small strips of blue painters tape but not sure it would hold when I load the rod.

I know I'm asking a bunch, but I want to wrap a couple of older rods before experimenting on a new blank. Next is to re wrap an old falcon Cara 6'6" M-MF. I broke the end off of the acs trigger so I removed the trigger as a whole and cannot fish this rod anymore as it just doesn't feel the same. Thanks for any help!

hoohoorjoo
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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by hoohoorjoo » Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:02 am

I'm not a rodbuilder, but a friend used tiny zip-ties to hold the guides for static load testing.
Try not to let your mind wander. It is much too small to be outside unsupervised.

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by bish0p » Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:05 pm

I don't know the type and size of line you use.
You can change the guide types and sizes as you see fit.

If you're using Fazlite:
KW 10 and 5.5
KB 5.5, 2 or 3 guides
KT 5.5, running guides as many as you need

I have the rings of the tip-top and running guides the same size.

I use guide tubing from Mudhole to secure the guides for the static load.
https://www.mudhole.com/Guide-Tubing

white84z
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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by white84z » Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:50 pm

hoohoorjoo wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:02 am
I'm not a rodbuilder, but a friend used tiny zip-ties to hold the guides for static load testing.
I don't know why I didn't think of this. I have boatloads of these laying around.

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by IlliniDawg01 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:23 pm

bish0p wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:05 pm
I don't know the type and size of line you use.
You can change the guide types and sizes as you see fit.

If you're using Fazlite:
KW 10 and 5.5
KB 5.5, 2 or 3 guides
KT 5.5, running guides as many as you need

I have the rings of the tip-top and running guides the same size.

I use guide tubing from Mudhole to secure the guides for the static load.
https://www.mudhole.com/Guide-Tubing
I do exactly this, though I use all belly K guides. I like stainless alconites, but the fazlites are probably good too.

white84z
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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by white84z » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:54 pm

bish0p wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:05 pm
I don't know the type and size of line you use.
You can change the guide types and sizes as you see fit.

If you're using Fazlite:
KW 10 and 5.5
KB 5.5, 2 or 3 guides
KT 5.5, running guides as many as you need

I have the rings of the tip-top and running guides the same size.

I use guide tubing from Mudhole to secure the guides for the static load.
https://www.mudhole.com/Guide-Tubing
Is the kw 5.5 for the bumper?

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by bish0p » Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:24 pm

I read too quick and missed you're building a simple spiral rod.

My list is for a casting rod, all guides on top. You can use the KW5.5 as the bumper that transitions to a KB5.5, or add a second KW5.5 as the bumper that transitions to the KW5.5, or use a 5.5 KB as a bumper.
As far as simple spiral, Tom Kirkman recommends using a two foot bumper guide, legs bent to bring the ring as close to the blank as possible. He says the bumper guide should not carry any load.

I've seen bumper guides built using single and two foot guides.

I haven't built a simple spiral rod yet.

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by Slazmo » Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:53 pm

With my spiral wrap I tested guide placement and load with sellotape... Didn't leave any residue and was easy to place and move along the blank.
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Mattman
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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by Mattman » Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:55 am

white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
1. What sizes would you recommend for the stripper, bumper and runner guides?
I don't do simple spiral wraps. I really don't like them at all and do a modified Roberts Wrap. That being said, on most freshwater rods, I will use three sizes total. Stripper, running, and transition.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
2. Do you size the tip the same as the runners or smaller?
I size my tip with my runners.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
3. How many of the heavier footed belly guides should I use after the stripper? Looks like Fuji suggest 2-3, wanted to see if it was even warranted.
Again...Roberts Wrap...

Typically, I only use one double foot guide.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
4. I have read that I will need to start with the same amount of guides in the original config, flip the runners 180 and static test it to verify correct placement. How are you guys securing guides to static test them where they won't come off?I was thinking some small strips of blue painters tape but not sure it would hold when I load the rod.
Have a roll of 1/8" wide masking tape on my tape dispenser.
Matt Davis
Otterods-High performance fishing rods

white84z
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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by white84z » Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:16 am

Mattman wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:55 am
white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
1. What sizes would you recommend for the stripper, bumper and runner guides?
I don't do simple spiral wraps. I really don't like them at all and do a modified Roberts Wrap. That being said, on most freshwater rods, I will use three sizes total. Stripper, running, and transition.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
2. Do you size the tip the same as the runners or smaller?
I size my tip with my runners.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
3. How many of the heavier footed belly guides should I use after the stripper? Looks like Fuji suggest 2-3, wanted to see if it was even warranted.
Again...Roberts Wrap...

Typically, I only use one double foot guide.


white84z wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
4. I have read that I will need to start with the same amount of guides in the original config, flip the runners 180 and static test it to verify correct placement. How are you guys securing guides to static test them where they won't come off?I was thinking some small strips of blue painters tape but not sure it would hold when I load the rod.
Have a roll of 1/8" wide masking tape on my tape dispenser.
Thanks for the input! I was debating on trying your version of the Roberts wrap when I do this rod but let a buddy convince me the simple spiral was just as good.

I have this in my cart right now for guides.
1 - size 10 KWFG double foot
3 - size 6 KBFG single foot belly
5 - size 5 KTFG runners.

Do you think the heavier single foot bellies are needed during the transition, after it or not at all?

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by Mattman » Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:46 am

white84z wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:16 am


I have this in my cart right now for guides.
1 - size 10 KWFG double foot
3 - size 6 KBFG single foot belly
5 - size 5 KTFG runners.

Do you think the heavier single foot bellies are needed during the transition, after it or not at all?
Needed? No.

But I like a transition look. And I would just do one of them, not three.
Matt Davis
Otterods-High performance fishing rods

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Re: Guide Reccomendation

Post by ogrich31 » Thu Jul 25, 2019 4:40 am

1. What sizes would you recommend for the stripper, bumper and runner guides?

I prefer a slower transition like Mattman as well. I'll go with something like 7, 6, 5, 5... My first 2 guides are usually double footed and the rest are single footed. Stripper (-5 to 0 degrees), then 3 or 4 transition guides trying to find a straight path. I'll test the path of the line on different angles while static testing.

Btw, I've built bass rods with all size 4 single footed guides and those rods were great. I didn't see a difference in casting distance.


2. Do you size the tip the same as the runners or smaller?

For me, it all depends on how straight the line path is. In my experience, most tips (same size as runners) will not be the same height as the runners. I'll go one size up on the tip on most builds. It's not uncommon for many rod builders to do this. But I really like Fuji Arowana tip tops as they match the height of the same size fuji KT runners.


3. How many of the heavier footed belly guides should I use after the stripper? Looks like Fuji suggest 2-3, wanted to see if it was even warranted.

I like to use 1 KB and the rest KT of the same size. I will however use 2 KB guides on some heavier rods that are a little more moderate, although it's probably not needed. Some guys who build heavier rods (big swimbait rod) use all KB guides as runners, although I haven't done this.

4. I have read that I will need to start with the same amount of guides in the original config, flip the runners 180 and static test it to verify correct placement. How are you guys securing guides to static test them where they won't come off?I was thinking some small strips of blue painters tape but not sure it would hold when I load the rod.

I like to use masking tape. It's very strong, and I have leaned back with a great amount of pressure on heavier saltwater rods to look at the line angles. This year I actually used masking tape on the guides of one ul build, letting my buddy use it for a trip. He caught a 4lb trout and no guides came off. He liked it, and I wrapped it later that week. I wouldn't recommend this though, as condensation or water can get on the sticky side of the tape, making it useless.

I've tried various methods to hold guides in place and keep coming back to masking tape, but everyone has their preferred methods when it comes to rod building.


Oh and I'd recommend that you test cast before you wrap your guides.

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