Product Insight on new Calcutta's

[jeb]

The Calcutta is not a niche reel. I am just saying that most bass anglers keep something that is dedicated and do not play around with settings once they find what is right for them.

Okay, I don't know if that's true or not. But if that's the thinking, why does Shimano offer the quick access sides on so many of their bass reels? Just does not make sense.

You cannot compare Japanese anglers to US anglers. First of all they take care of their reels much better than the average US angler. They also use the reels for different applications. They understand finesse. Most bass anglers in the US use 17-20# for everything. As I stated previously the 50 and 100 went away due to poor sales in those sizes. That alone should answer your question.

I've seen some pretty beat up reels advertised from Japanese anglers, so I'm not sure you can really make that broad of a statement. I can buy the "it's cheaper" angle (no pun intended), but it's hard to buy the "stronger, so you clumsy Americans won't mangle them and then be mad at us for it" arguement.

[Bantam1]

A low profile reel does not have a forged frame like the round reel. Less machine work is needed since they are castings. You are comparing apples to oranges with that statement.

I honestly believe the message as to what the Calcutta is has been lost. Calcutta was made for power fishing with baits that have a lot of resistance. It is not a pitching reel. It is not a finesse reel. It is made to pull on large fish with a smaller reel. We added several features to aid with this. The mission dirves the gear requirement. If you are looking for the Calcutta for an all around reel, this is not going to be it. It is similar to trying to use the Core 50 to fish a Huddleston.

I am speaking from my experience of speaking with several Japanese anglers that I have met. I also have spoken to the repair department in Japan. I know the numbers and see what the differences are from a repair side of the business. The frame thing is an observation I made while being the Platinum reel technician for many years, and based on the numbers of frames we replaced over the life of the TE model. Most from being dropped and damaged, and a few from corrosion due to a lack of proper maintenance.

Cheaper is a relative term. JDM reels are not covered by our warranty and we do not stock parts for them. You save X amount of money but give up future support. Is it still a savings?

I realize that almost everyone here is an expert on all things fishing, business, manufacturing. I obviously do not know what I am talking about. In a perfect world we could build the reel for less and make everyone happy. The current economic state is not allowing us to build the reels for less, and forcing us to eliminate some features. We knew that there would be some complaints about the lack of quick access to the VBS. However, due to the increased costs we had to eliminate it. So far all I see is speculation about the reel and complaints from many who have never used the reel. I think if you fished the reel out of the box you would see that the brake setting is perfect for about 90% of what the reel will be used for. Everyone that I have fished with that has used it has been more than happy with it.

[GARRIGA]

The more I think about my actual on the water use the less I care about VBS access and actually prefer the solid approach as I have for a decade with my Trinidads.

My sole concern is the gearing. Is this powerful enough to endure 8 hour days cranking large resistance baits like a 3:16 Armagedon or Bull Shad 9" or Real Prey 10" or the ever popular Hudd 8? Based on many hard core swimbait fisherman the 400 TE was/is more than capable. I want to be able to match that requirement with the new D 301/401.

I'm now finding out that the D was based off the old B and not TE gear set. Is this true or is this now a new gear set different than either and comparable to the TE? I've never fished the B or TE so I'm at a disadvantage and want to know if I can trust the D to match what I'm intending to do or should I seek a TE while they are still available? Don't like buying used so my options are limited. I have the perfect rod for my focus and just looking for an honest recommendation on reel to pair with it.

[Bantam1]

The gearing is not like the B or the TE. It is unique to the D series. The reel has more than enough power to handle big bait fishing all day. I think you will be surprised with how this reel fishes compared to the B and the TE. The new gear design we are using helps with adding power without making the gears larger in diameter than what is necessary. X-Ship also does wonders with reducing the effort under a load. If you have fished the Trinidad A then you will understand.

[GARRIGA]

That's the kind info I've been seeking and was wrongly assuming. I was starting to think the D was just an upgraded B and that's not the case. For my intended lures, would you recommend the 401 or can I go with the higher IPT 301. I'm thinking 5.1 is better but that extra line pickup could prove beneficial on a long cast.

[Cal]

.. or can I go with the higher IPT 301. I'm thinking 5.1 is better but that extra line pickup could prove beneficial on a long cast.

Without looking at the actual line pick up spec, keep in mind the 400 may have a lower gear ratio, but it also has a larger diamenter spool. So your actual IPT is probably pretty close through the lineup.

[Bantam1]

300D- 30 IPT (Same as Curado 300E)
400D- 27 IPT

[Bantam1]

I promised a pic of this earlier. As you can see there are no loose gears when the side plate has been removed to adjust the VBS. Just like the original Calcutta models with upgrades:

[GARRIGA]

.. or can I go with the higher IPT 301. I'm thinking 5.1 is better but that extra line pickup could prove beneficial on a long cast.

Without looking at the actual line pick up spec, keep in mind the 400 may have a lower gear ratio, but it also has a larger diamenter spool. So your actual IPT is probably pretty close through the lineup.

I recall Bantam 1 confirming the 400 was just a wider version of the 300 and the other difference being the 5.1 vs 5.7. I would prefer to get the 300/301 because I'm not a fan of wide reels. If the 5.7 have enough torque to pull the larger resistance baits than I prefer that narrower option.

Not sure if 30" vs 27" makes a noticeable difference so now I'm more concerned about all day comfort. I'm going to pass by BPS with my rod to see how the 400 feels on it. They expect to have the 300 shortly and I don't think the lefties are out till end of year so I have some time to decide.

Funny thing is I speed jig with a Trinidad 20 by palming the side plate and here I am worried about millimeter differences between two reels. Bass fishin has turned me into a wimp. Lol

[Bantam1]

I prefer the 300 for big baits. I use a 300TE, then the Curado 300 and now I will have a 300D once I have the chance to get one. It has more than enough torque.

[GARRIGA]

Decisions are my biggest issue therefore I just ordered both from TW through their demo program. Supposedly the 301/401 are available tomorrow. I'm stoked and should have these puppies on the water the following weekend. An end to speculation and time for some real time experience. No Armageddon to try out but I'll give them a run with the monster bull shad, Hudd 8, Shell Cracker and may be my Wake Jrs arrive in time for some dual tests. I'm a very happy camper.

[Cal]

Decisions are my biggest issue therefore I just ordered both...

[dragon1]

Hahaha...lovin' this as a good follow-up to the Presidential Race.

Truth in engineering (sorry Audi), or translation in marketing via (IMO, short-minded or at least incomplete-minded) designed cost cutting...regardless, the answers and reiterations from Bantam1 are appropriate in his being an Ambassador of Shimano USA, but also notes a tone of stress and a little defiance (or maybe denial...sorry Bantam1, but calling it like I read it).

- Not all Japanese "used reels" were gently "pre-owned" (as already noted).

- We are not saying you don't know what you are talking about...but yes, you are correct whether sarcastically or not - there are experts of many different fields of life, study, work, instruction, teaching, etc., within the TT brotherhood.

- Larger HEG (or like design main drive gears) do not necessarily make a reel more powerful in cranking than one that does not have it...and "X-SHIP" is an enhancement that other manufacturers have known of, and employed, for some time.

- Excellent to read of the "better", newly designed gears for the D as it appears to be an upgrade and further progression of the Calcutta vs what has recently happened to the Curado and Chronarch line-up.

WoodT - I appreciate your insight and candor.

Feelings on both sides were to be expected, just as the notable split in the United States currently as to which wing our National Bird should fly with...I would hope BOTH.

[dragon1]

One more note - if Yuki Ito were to jump ship tomorrow to Shimano...you guys would likely have him as soon as the contract could be drawn up.

The want and need of creating JDM/"Elitist"/Limited Edition Offerings from both of the Two Rising Sun Giants has already been openly committed to by both sides...hence Shimano-Jackall.

[WoodT]

I realize that almost everyone here is an expert on all things fishing, business, manufacturing. I obviously do not know what I am talking about.

I won't chase this any more, Bantam. Speculating on a drastic reel design...not reel performance...obviously should not be done unless I buy one so I can do both activities from two feet away.

I never claimed to be an expert on fishing. I am pretty sure I try to declare here that I suck, and my opinion is subjective, as often as I can. I think you know plenty more about fishing than me. Relative to the other stuff, who knows. You'd have to buy me to be sure.

But in all seriousness, I will continue to enjoy every one of the Shimano products I own, and ones I will own in the future. I am pretty sure my extreme confidence in your current and future product set should not be qualified by others simply if a person might be implying in this thread that my opinion is uninformed.